Gentle persuasion over time

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JR.
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by JR. » Wed Oct 16, 2019 8:09 am

terkio wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:20 pm
To help persuade your tree, how about digging to weaken its roots.
The more I think about this, the more I like the idea of weakening the roots opposite the direction I want it to fall... I have a nice long handle axe perfect for this task.

[edit-] I just went out and checked... three large feeder roots evenly spaced axially. One pointing exactly opposite the direction I want it to fall... roots are stronger in tension than compression, or twisting, so cutting the one root in tension should help nudge this tree down in the right direction. While out there I cranked in two more clicks tighter on the come along... Before the nylon tow rope failed it stopped stretching and for two days in a row I couldn't make the come along any tighter. [/edit]
Being dead, I doubt it will give under the strap pulling.
it hasn't so far, but i hope I put enough force in the right direction to overcome gravity pulling it the wrong way.
May be it will give if the ground is soft enough, weakening at the roots might help especially if they don't run deep underground.
The tree is pretty tall with no lower branches... I suspect it has been competing for sunlight with the other trees for a long time. It has branches up top. Ironic perhaps that it grew tall enough above the others to be the one hit by lightning... :lol:
Depends of trees. Some have a flat root system. Some have a deep pillar rooting, these are hell to extract the stump.
Stumps suck, some are harder to remove than others... I look forward to this tree becoming a stump. 8-)

Still no hurry...

JR
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by JR. » Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:00 pm

decided to cut the obvious root in tension with my axe...
root.png
Pretty good sized root, cut clean through... no difference. :oops:

Here is picture of the original nylon tow rope...
busted rope.png
The single remaining red strand did not fail... Perhaps it was longer than the others, or stretched.
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terkio
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by terkio » Thu Oct 17, 2019 5:25 pm

I think it takes more roots cut, deeper underground.
We extracted a stump of a tree cut high to have good leverage pulling with a 2 tons come-along.
The game was, digging and cutting the roots under tension. That was hard work before the trunck began to lean.

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JR.
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by JR. » Thu Oct 17, 2019 8:14 pm

Yup, I was overly optimistic... when I had to dig out the stump from the pecan tree that feel last summer, I found roots growing beneath the roots, and then roots beneath them... and that was after the tree fell down.

I cut that 8" root and no difference I can see... At a minimum it should make it easier for mother nature to take it down. The top 50% of the root was already rotted so rest of the roots should be getting weaker with time.

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terkio
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by terkio » Fri Oct 18, 2019 5:57 am

Rot is good help to get rid of stumps.
Fungus too.
I had a large stump that was taking ages to rot, I had chain sawed as much I could to dig in to help rotting, but the big roots were a lasting trouble deep under pillars of a gate. Then some mushrooms came in and speeded up the root decay eating the stump from inside.
I wondered wether mushroom knowledge could be a nice way to get rid of tree stumps.

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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by JR. » Fri Oct 18, 2019 8:02 am

Since the burn ban has been rescinded I am resisting the temptation to move my now substantial burn pile over to around that dead tree to see if I could light it up... That seems like a spectacularly bad idea (even for me).

I had some success disappearing one old stump that way, after only a few weekends of burning dead branches, but never tried burning a whole tree while still standing. :lol:

At this point I don't much care about the stump, I just don't like having a tall, very dead tree, in my yard. The lightning hit separated the bark and there is a lot of insect activity under the remaining loose bark.

I still haven't given up on my gentle persuasion, and am considering some less gentle chain saw selective weakening. To give my come along approach some chance of success I need to give it more time. No hurry.

JR
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by terkio » Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:36 pm

Burning the roots is an interesting option 8-)

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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by JR. » Fri Oct 18, 2019 8:04 pm

terkio wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:36 pm
Burning the roots is an interesting option 8-)
Dubious while the tree is still standing.

I spent some more quality time examining it, while i burned my huge pile of dead branches elsewhere.

The tree looked less tilted so I pulled out my bubble level and indeed the trunk at the base is still leaning an estimated 10 degrees in the direction opposite from where I want it to fall. I suspect hurricane Katrina bent it that way years ago.. (I lost a half dozen trees from that storm). The first 40' or so from the ground up is leaning one way, then the tree started growing straight up from there. It almost looks like the center of mass is already toward the direction I want it to fall, but I don't feel that lucky... dropping trees is not about luck.

I peeled off some more of the loose bark and the trunk is rotted in several places. A good thing for my strategy of letting nature drop it in a good direction. I relieved all three of the feeder roots and only half of one was not rotting too.

I need to be more patient... This puppy will fall by itself soon enough. I just want to nudge it in a good direction.

JR
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mediatechnology
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by mediatechnology » Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:13 pm

terkio wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 5:57 am
Rot is good help to get rid of stumps.
Fungus too.
I had a large stump that was taking ages to rot, I had chain sawed as much I could to dig in to help rotting, but the big roots were a lasting trouble deep under pillars of a gate. Then some mushrooms came in and speeded up the root decay eating the stump from inside.
I wondered wether mushroom knowledge could be a nice way to get rid of tree stumps.
I've used refined sugar to accelerate stump decay.
I think molasses would work well too.

JR: What species is this dead tree?
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Re: Gentle persuasion over time

Post by JR. » Sat Oct 19, 2019 7:14 pm

mediatechnology wrote:
Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:13 pm
terkio wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 5:57 am
Rot is good help to get rid of stumps.
Fungus too.
I had a large stump that was taking ages to rot, I had chain sawed as much I could to dig in to help rotting, but the big roots were a lasting trouble deep under pillars of a gate. Then some mushrooms came in and speeded up the root decay eating the stump from inside.
I wondered wether mushroom knowledge could be a nice way to get rid of tree stumps.
I've used refined sugar to accelerate stump decay.
I think molasses would work well too.
I searched for shrooms in my yard and they have been scarce since the drought (now officially over).

I could pour the "trub", left over remnants after cooking a batch of beer on it. The trub has some malt (sugar) left in it.. I typically pour it over my compost heap... The tree slugs et al will like it better than the compost worms do.
JR: What species is this dead tree?
Very dead...? I can ask my old farmer neighbor what species, he knows stuff like that. It has crazy thick bark, all falling off because of the lightning... nothing I recognize. IIRC cotton wood had a thick bark like that, maybe a cotton wood? It doesn't look like other cotton woods around.

I am feeling better that it will fall naturally... the stump is rotting already, all by itself. Hopefully my come along line will steer it away from my neighbor's store when it falls.

JR
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